Suggest a Windows RT for x64

Question

Windows RT is one excellent platform for mobile computing incorporating ARM-based computers. How much I love Microsoft Windows on platforms other than x86/x64, such as early days PowerPC, MIPS, Alpha and even Itanium, unifying different platforms presenting one common interface for end users and developers. I love Surface RT for it is not an embedded system like a functional phone or a traditional computer such as setting on desk or lap, for its limited but specific applications meeting every day's usage. I don't need it to do something without its reach. Such a clever and adorable thing always brings me the easy feeling with it. But as we know Windows RT is different from Windows 8 for many respects, and tablets based on Intel ATOM cores are not strong enough for most desktop applications. Comparing with ARM cores, ATOM is another economic and widely acceptable cores for mobile computing. Will Microsoft provide one ATOM optimized Windows RT for tablets incorporating it? Desktop applications for them seem not that important for its limited computing execution resources, and Windows 8/8 Pro is just that one not that suitable for that platform.

            If two Windows RT platforms are available, they both would satisfy different users, and most important, keep a balanced competitions across cores for mobile. End users would never care about its underlying support hardware, but the upper Windows RT, same apps on different architectures for tablets could accelerate metro platform evolution.

Answer 1

If Windows RT for x64 would be provided, I think it should be further slimmed to

     1. Eliminate Wow64 layer, without supporting traditional x86 at all.

     2. Use some ATOM exclusive instructions to avoid other x64 based processors to use it.

     3. Office RT reserved...

Answer 2

One year later I get back to my post here, and today, the ATOM based tablets have already on sale shelves and much cheaper than Surface too, but of course, this post is definitively igrnored. Microsoft satisfies these tablets with Windows 8.1 with Bing, just a licence changed version of Windows 8.1 U1. After evaluating serveral tablets like that, I feel a bit diappointed. Take a 1GiB Memory, 16G SD one for example, after install Windows 8.1 with Bing, it is almost not able to updates the system, for its 16G space has almost eaten up for nothing.

      Yeah, I have to commit that these tablets are too cheap, but when one finds there is almost no room to update or to install Apps, so I hardly think microsoft would benefit from this thing well. Cheap price is the best chance for everyone to purchase, and the best chance for microsoft to introduce Windows to everyone's hand. But for the situation right now, this Windows with Bing just persudes most users to use Android instead. Anyhow in any country, for everyone, the purchaser might just want to get a tablet to use, rather than always consider my tablet is out of reach of its defaut OS.

      I just wish, or suggest Microsoft would make something right in right time, not let their users lose faith in it.

Answer 3

Well, the thought process you have is good.  64-bit ARM processors are on the scene and Qualcomm is in Microsoft's envelope now.

The ATOM is also going 64-bit and the current 32-bit "Bay Trail" is an impressive CPU.

What should happen for tablets and should have been done since day one was put the operating system on chips (flash memory).  Leave the storage wide open and chips would act as a shadow "Drive C:".  Tandy used to do that with the old Tandy computers where they not only had MS-DOS on chips but also Deskmates (framework) on the chips as well.  The real Drive C: had full capacity and nothing was used for the system until you started installing your software and the rest of Deskmates to make it functional.

Flash memory would allow updates to the operating system and even make the computer more secure.  No recovery system would be needed (it could be on a flash chip as well).  That would use a little space on the motherboard but would leave the SSD card wide open for storage.

If you think a SSD card is fast booting up?  Booting from flash is instant!

However, keep thinking the way you are, because that may already be in the works.  There is nothing really wrong with the ARM processor as long as you don't really need much in software other than what is already on the tablet.  The included Microsoft Office

• Outlook: you can do anything with those.  Just a few apps from the Store and you can do anything you want.

Answer 4

Even though I could not understand what you mean here exactly, but I do have to say thank you. "Bay Trail" is the code name for a series of Intel Atom processors, which is 64-bit processors, with legacy support for IA-32. Most Tablets based on this kinda processors in China mainland provide only IA-32 ECL for UEFI, which means only 32bit OS could be loaded by the UEFI. For the current situation of Microsoft Windows, the only way to utilize its 64-bit capability is using virtual machine software. But for the only 1GiB memory configuration, that does really look ridiculous. So even though most tablets labeled as 64-bit intel core inside, there is almost impossible to expose its 64-bit computing power at all. When I was enjoying Windows XP Professional x64 in 2005, I found PC even equipped with 1GiB memory sometimes could make HDD light turning on and on for lot of times, which means, 1GiB is not adequate for 64-bit OS. I've no ideas about the Windows XP 64-bit Edition for Itanium 2002, but its requirement in 2001, need at least 1GiB system memory. So I could not imagine even though the manufacturers could provide x64 ECL for UEFI, what the tablet could feel like when running under x64 edtions of Windows 8/8.1. But I am so sure that these "Bay Trail" processors are much stronger than the processors in Microsoft Surface 1st under 32bit mode.

     I've no ideas about ARM64 whether it also provides the legacy support for the 32bit mode. If, I think and believe the situation is much similar with those ATOM processors mentioned above. Other posts of mine in other topics stated that the only way to fully utilize the potential power of ATOM and ARM64 is just sitting the Windows core onto the 32bit mode but provides support for 64-bit APPs. That might be the initial purpose of Intel for several of their 64-bit processors with support of maximum 1GiB memory. But comparing against Playstation 3 and Xbox360, both are 64-bit game consoles, only equipped only 256MiB or 512MiB system memory but giving out a splendid performance for the games. I could not expect APPs would get close to games for game console, but tending the tablet OS towards to the game consle might be the key to conquer the tablets market.

P.S. I might mentioned firmware size, but I don't mean that OS need to be programmed onto EPROM, leaving the updates to the external storage. I just expect tablet OS could have an acceptable size to be welcome by most tablets including entry-level tablets, and the processor's the power should as possible as it can be sacrificed onto the actual apps rather than the smart algorithms on platform/architecture emulation. Surface might need a Office to make imaginations to pictures. But for pure tablets app-based Office might be the first choice...Sorry for all my ideas here...

Answer 5

Well the costs of SSD cards are coming down and there should be no excuse to not have at least a 250GB model at the minimum for the price charged for the tablets.  I bought one for $130 and use it for external backup storage.

Game consoles are fixed and will surprise you when you see the CPU that is in them.  They don't have the overhead of a regular computer even though they are computers themselves.

The example I made about Tandy computers where the core set of MS-DOS and part of the Deskmates (you can look it up in Wikipedia if you want to learn more about it) and occupied no space on the storage.  The EEPROM chips in those days where small in storage but flash memory used in their place are not read only.  They can be updated/upgraded.  GRID laptops also used that same concept and had a bay just above the keyboard where the user could insert EEPROM chips preloaded with software and required no disk space for except for data storage.  That is one of the key problems with the Surface tablets is that a bulk of the storage is used up for not only the operating system and software but also the recovery and using a small capacity storage device to boot.

UEFI is going to be here to stay and the ARM and ATOM processors will remain at the low end of the spectrum but they do their jobs pretty well.  By the way, UEFI is going to replace BIOS and is being phased in gradually.  Some computer motherboards are already shipping with no BIOS.

Now, the RT line is going to remain and there is still a future for it.  The 64-bit variants are In production but the systems that are the focus is actually Linux and Android.  The single board computers are what's driving that and are becoming a big hit in robotics (not just regular computers).  Also, your 3D printers on the market use them as well.

I think in the future, Windows will have to be totally rewritten from the ground up and not carry code over from one version to the next.  You saw part of the reason with Windows XP 64-bit which really didn't work well.  Lack of software was a hamper also.