WHY ARE MICROSFT KILLING VISUAL BASIC AND THIER USERS? in favour on third party programming languges

Leroy 46

My question is Why is Visual basic (the original programming language) being leverage out of Microsoft? Today there are many programming languages in the world currently in use as well as the mass migration to the python platform ... which would not have been possible if Visual Basic had become Open source much longer ago! as well as Microsoft Dumping visual basic to Enforce the use of C# ..... Again Microsoft MISSES EVERYTHING!...... The visual basic Readable language vs the C# Cryptic language or Conformist language. We have recently heard and seen publications of the drop of visual basic and now it is heavily seen on the new Microsoft sites as the help / MSDN / TUTORIALS and functionality of visual basic is being made to pay! Basic originally Ran like python and could be executed on the fly and today Microsoft have still refused to create a repl for visual basic which would have been massively comparable and easier to use for Microsoft users instead of PYTHON which noticeably Microsoft have been utilizing now ???? WHY! anything that can be done in python can be done in visual basic and any type of co0mponent which can be shared as a library can now be shared over nuget ... So Again Why the drop of the support for Visual basic? As we cannot connect to UNITY EITHER? but any .DOT.NET product should connect to EVERY OTHER .DOTNET PRODUCT? .... Today visual basic is the tramp of a programming languages which it was a flagship and standard for every spinoff today!

Vadymyr 1 Reputation point

2022-03-22T20:01:15.743+00:00

IMHO,
not even MICROSFT are getting rid of Visual Basic...

Shall We really re-work Visual Basic?..
We also have FreeBASIC, can We do something at there?..

4 answers

Karen Payne MVP 35,191 Reputation points

2021-03-11T12:52:28.257+00:00

Hello @Leroy

At a recent event known as Ignite Kathleen Dollard (Principal Program Manager, .NET) indicated that Microsoft is not dropping VB.NET from the ecosystem. What they are doing is not advancing the language to keep up with C# new features (like in C#9 and onwards) and Blazer.

Although an older post it's worth checking out Microsoft: 'We Do Not Plan to Evolve Visual Basic as a Language'.

And than there is the community of developers which Microsoft listens too like Stackoverflow yearly survey which VB.NET in most cases does not even show up or if it does not very much.

With this said, I'd expect that unless one is building cross platform with Xamarin VB should be a viable language for a long time but than again depending on what is needed VB may fail short and the need to move away from VB might be an option.

If we look back at history to VB Classic, there are still many coders using VB Classic because they can get solutions done while others have moved to VB.NET and another group has moved to C#.

Being a developer means that sometimes change is inevitable and in this case it's dependent on can the selected language get the job done. No matter what developers say about keeping VB.NET in pace with C# is never going to happen, Microsoft cares about developers but we also must understand the bottom line is making a profit.
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Jonathan Allen 11 Reputation points

2021-03-15T05:03:19.103+00:00

Is there any possibility that Microsoft will turn over maintenance of VB to the community like they did for F#? (Assuming, for the sake of argument, that there are enough non-MS people willing to take a leadership role.)

Karen Payne MVP 35,191 Reputation points

2021-03-15T12:39:46.697+00:00

Check out the following GitHub page. There you will find developers expanding the language and also links to code samples such as mine.
Here is a peek at some of the work being done,

Jonathan Allen 11 Reputation points

2021-03-15T15:45:34.41+00:00

Thank you!

Leroy 46 Reputation points

2021-03-16T09:59:07.067+00:00

As we know stack overflow as reddit sites are not real as you can basically find some answer to any question which will fit your purpose which even may not be true . Both of the sites are computer controlled and there is no actual facts on those sites! Mostly used by people who cannot program to get solutions .

The usage of Visual Basic is very high and the community of users is very high : as well as being a very high impact on non English speakers .

Being the original programming language it seems still that Microsoft has employed mainly c# users who have abandoned the Visual Basic language . Punishing hose who do no wish to change their programming languages or styles .
Microsoft is currently pushing more effort into Python ! And again giving the message as you have that we should follow along and allow our programming language not to be evolved ... but the other languages evolved ? Foxpro or F is currently receiving a boost ? Why ? This is a dead language ?

Amir Iftikhar 11 Reputation points

2021-03-31T11:00:50.773+00:00

Hi @LoreyDyer, I would suggest you to move on to C# because its very powerful and it has a future because Microsoft is working very hard to keep the pace and facilitate the developers. VB is something that couldn't keep the pace with the other technology stacks.

Leroy 46 Reputation points

2021-03-31T19:20:10.683+00:00

Not true ; most Microsoft development team were vb or c/c+ users but as the modernisation techniques of university’s go they transitioned into c# with the point of preparing the next gen as with after it was java and now python ... it’s a form of devolution from actual programming to modular programming where you just search for the appropriate extension or plugin such as numpy etc or a nuget package ... even .net has advanced from simple .net to xaml and razor pages etc so transitioning to other languages as a developer is always something your forced to do ... but in truth as you age you do get stuck or even comfortable with a specific language for creation ... as a scientist I use many languages and have to decyper other languages to use for various aspects of work ..: but for creating things I still use Visual Basic for its speed of design and build as well as c# being competitive I have found nothing that one could do that the other could not ...

Leroy 46 Reputation points

2021-03-31T19:24:12.067+00:00

In reality ;
There is no need for Visual Basic to develop further but to keep it fully supported yes ;
The one greatest disappointment is not being able to utilise UNTITY with Visual Basic ! For me that would be the final development required to allow it to be finalised ! As this is still the greatest addition to the .net programming ! ...

Personally I still do not use xaml either !...

Jan Ulik 0 Reputation points

2023-01-13T15:33:52.7333333+00:00

So what is the future of VBA then?, Microsoft is looking the bottom line "profit", so the VB is being forgotten, also because of C# new future etc? So will be future of VB only in Applications? I mean VBA? Can you make a clear statement on this?
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Leroy 46 Reputation points

2021-03-11T10:48:22.557+00:00

Our Visual basic Community is being destroyed and we are being pushed away from Microsoft!
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Jeff Russell 5 Reputation points

2023-05-05T16:32:00.6033333+00:00

In my opinion, Visual Basic dot net is a much better language than C#. Here's why:

First, they are both capable of the same functions (except for 2 very narrow instances).

Second, the fact that Visual Basic is highly human-readable to anyone on the planet who speaks English is a huge plus! This facilitates collaboration. (A HUGE plus!)

Third, C# has arcane (difficult to read) nomenclature (syntax) and enforces silly rules (like case sensitivity).

Fourth, any computer scientist will tell you that one of the major goals of coding is SIMPLICITY (without sacrificing function). - VB supports simplicity while not sacrificing any function. (It can do anything that C# can.)

Fifth, VB integrates with the Microsoft Office Suite (or whatever they are calling it these days) through VBA and shell scripting.

In my opinion, Microsoft is taking a very wrong turn by deliberately encouraging esoterica instead of simplicity.
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Leroy 46 Reputation points

2023-08-08T16:13:17.05+00:00

C# has arcane (difficult to read) yes this is why also people today are dropping c# It was a battle with java .. and yet even java was truly short live. Today VB.net has been relegated to the lower levels and the Cheep nasty python has even been given mopre attention by microsoft...
they have even forgotten to build the llm models and connectors to huggingface and have again put thier attention to python !!!
An earlier comment Quoted wikipedia! lol... perhaps he was not there in the begining to experience the home computers and first machines which used BASIC. And todays basic is the evolotion of this ... Where are our VECTORS/DATAFRAMES/MATRIXES/TENSORS? Where are our UNITY CONNECTORS? ... do we not compile to the same Abstract Syntax Tree? So what is the problem ! really microsoft have a lot to answer for! as it is a small task to extend ....emmm what is this F# getting more proiority than basic????
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Sam of Simple Samples 5,516 Reputation points

2021-03-11T17:56:13.8+00:00

Visual Basic was not the original programming language. The first compiler was for the FLOW-MATIC - Wikipedia language. And C# is not third-party; it was designed by Microsoft.

Visual Basic is derived from the BASIC language. VB.Net improves on that immensely. Like PHP, there has always been strong opinions on the advantages and disadvantages of the BASIC language. In 1975 Dijkstra said (see the PDF How do we tell truths that might hurt):

It is practically impossible to teach good programming to students that have had a prior exposure to BASIC: as potential programmers they are mentally mutilated beyond hope of regeneration.

However he was highly opinionated and degraded most languages in existence then but the BASIC language has always been controversial.

Edsger W. Dijkstra is relevant for his vast accomplishments in programming. As I said, he was highly critical of most computer languages of his time. He was however active in the design and development of the ALGOL language, a language designed by computer language specialists. Many languages are derived from ALGOL, including C, C++, Java and C#. As you indicated, Microsoft chose to maintain the design of VB.Net as proprietary. C# however is an international standard and a member of a highly respected family of computer languages.
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Jonathan Allen 11 Reputation points

2021-03-15T05:01:28.663+00:00

Repeating Dijkstra's ignorant comments contributes nothing to the conversation. And saying this:

procedure Absmax(a) Size:(n, m) Result:(y) Subscripts:(i, k); value n, m; array a; integer n, m, i, k; real y; comment The absolute greatest element of the matrix a, of size n by m is transferred to y, and the subscripts of this element to i and k; begin integer p, q; y := 0; i := k := 1; for p := 1 step 1 until n do for q := 1 step 1 until m do if abs(a[p, q]) > y then begin y := abs(a[p, q]); i := p; k := q end end Absmax

Was the basis for "C, C++, Java and C#" is nonsensical.

Sam of Simple Samples 5,516 Reputation points

2021-03-15T05:44:35.197+00:00

Experts say that C, C++, Java and C# are derived from ALGOL. If you disagree with the experts then this is not the place to discuss that.

Jonathan Allen 11 Reputation points

2021-03-15T06:00:27.473+00:00

Actually, they say it "eventually gave rise to many other programming languages, including PL/I, Simula, BCPL, B, Pascal, and C". And since VB.NET was heavily influenced by Simula and and Pascal, by that argument VB is likewise "a member of a highly respected family of computer languages".

So in conclusion, the claims that a language that was distantly inspired by ALGOL is inherently better than another language that was distantly inspired by ALGOL is just plain silly.

Albert Kallal 4,651 Reputation points

2021-03-16T00:25:47.937+00:00

Ford vs Chevy discussions? Kind of fun in high school! But, now? Well, not so much fun!

However, at the time? Those comments about BASIC were made in the context that THAT time frame.

Back then, most BASIC variants used line numbers, had heavy use of GOTO, and did not have if/then/else, and things like cases statements.

Today, modern vb.net is a full structured language - and only bears "some" resemblance to those older carnations of BASIC of which Dijkstra was talking about.

So in any "discussion" the context, the time frame, and the state of affairs in regards to BASIC at that time is not really a fair characterization of was Dijstra was talking about. I also accept using non structured languages and having no classes etc would be a HUGE issue.

So, vb.net has really next to none of those legitimate complaints about BASIC as a language in general.

I maintain quite a few systems written in vb.net - I suspect I be doing so for quite some time!

Sam of Simple Samples 5,516 Reputation points

2021-03-16T01:28:35.417+00:00

Ford vs Chevy style discussions are inappropriate here; these forums are not designed to discuss extensive discussion, correct?

Albert Kallal 4,651 Reputation points

2021-03-16T04:26:04.763+00:00

I never used the word inappropriate here - you did!!

If was if not clear by what that statement meant? I simple stated that these types of car x vs y or developer tools x vs y can be tiring and were fun when we were young and not so wise. And they tend to be opinioned - and that's not the most productive use of ones time and efforts.

However, I did add that the quote and context of such claims by Dijkstra need appropriate context. As such his comments would not apply to modern versions of basic like we have with vb.net.

Thus based on this correctly pointed out context? Then an attempt to use Dijkstra's credibility to disparage say a modern system and language like vb.net does not apply, and hence is without merit in this context. As such, applying his comments to vb.net is simply not a valid argument and pretext that one should attempt to use against the merits of vb.net.

Regards,
Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP 2003-2017)
Edmonton, Alberta Canada

Leroy 46 Reputation points

2021-03-16T10:06:49.227+00:00

You do not sound intellectual spouting known information and praising silliness ! As you miss the point completely !

Constructor is the original / then also basic ... c# and vb are the modern derivatives ... simple java etc are derivatives of c ! ... but again all that convo has no value !
As it’s about the reasoning behind dropping Visual Basic ! Especially when there are people still using it in-depth and the language has not been abandoned by users !
Microsoft are the ones FORCING !
It takes nothing to maintain a language as they are all compiled to the same code in the end ! So as compiler develops the syntax for c# or Vb can be added so there is no valid reason at all ! Redit and stack overflow do not have the opinion of the programming comunity ! They are for the people begging for shortcuts

Leroy 46 Reputation points

2021-03-26T13:43:08.017+00:00

In truth your right ;
The modern .net version of visual basic is still able to perform any such task as required of it as well as the development of the syntax and paradigms are all contained within both .net models .
Once it is also understood that the interpretor or abstract syntax trees produced also are the same from Vb and c# it also provides the understanding that there is simply n need to drop the language as it's the interpretor which is truly updated and the syntax is nearly added to the top level programming language therefoee neither languge should be able to have a foothold over the other ! In fact simply syntax differences . .... This also makes the point for not adding afformentiojed syntax to the Vb also makes it - madness as a reason to drop visual basic or even any .net languge at all ...

This is precisely the point of the argument ! Why even consider such an act ?

Today people are even producing thier own languages on top of .net

ANTHONY NORTON 1 Reputation point

2021-11-02T18:56:38.717+00:00

It's amazing, but nobody has mention QBASIC which although interpreted (there were some compilers available), was a well-structured programming language that resembled Pascal in it's procedure, function, and explicit type declarations. You could seamlessly jump to some programs and return automatically upon the user exiting them. That's when I believe Microsoft decided to emphasize VB as an easily accessible tool for experienced and beginning programmers. So long Qbasic.

Leroy 46 Reputation points

2023-08-08T16:19:07.5433333+00:00

in the early days people were racing to create programming languages derived from C etc ... doe s not mean they were great ... there is nothing wrong with C# ? really its only syntax as well as basic being exactly the same and only sytnactically different ... in thriuth they have both been left although c# has had connectors to other environments ... which basic has not ? why not ? this is the true question regarding this stuff ... as you know its the same model and easily adjusted to keep both languages in line.... Why has python had additions which .net has been left behind? where is out version of pytorch? or tensorflow? microsoft have left thier programming langugaes and concentrating on azure and forcing peopole to buy services instead perhaps the future is python led! where is the development team of microsoft? beth massey etc... did they loose them all for .. badly trained universty students pushed to use only FREE STUFF!
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